It is currently Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:21 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 7:37 pm 

Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2012 11:22 pm
Posts: 66
Location: York, PA
All,
I am looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C from. I am looking to replace the Lexan in the sliding windows of an EMD SW9
Thanks!


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:12 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:54 am
Posts: 889
Location: New Franklin, OH
Is this unit used in freight service? Otherwise, it may be exempt from Part 223 requirements. Glazing meeting Part 223 is very expensive.

_________________
Eric Schlentner
Orrville Railroad Heritage Society
Car Knocker, Gandy Dancer & Hog Jockey
https://orrvillerailroad.com


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:32 pm 

Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:11 pm
Posts: 48
Actually 25C itself does not meet the part 223 spec it is meant to be used in a window with multiple sheets and an air space between them to meet the spec. I quoted Lexan MRT last week at less than 400 dollars for a 4 by 8 sheet and it would be the same result. A non part 223 compliant window but with better vandal resistance than glass. If you want to meet part 223 you need to go to FRA460 lexan and assuming you can rout the edges of your windows to .25 inches to install in existing frames you'd probably be OK and meet the spec. If you search for Palgard .25 theres a video of a single sheet surviving the test on their web site someplace. Your next best choice is actual FRA glass at 3/8ths inch thick to meet part 223 type 2 spec which may not fit in your 25C frame.

I've gotten quotes for the various materials in the last week. Not many folks are stocking the materials right now. I may elect to go to Lexan 25C myself and file the waiver. The real question is do you need to meet the FRA type 2 spec.

Fred.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:37 pm 

Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:11 pm
Posts: 48
PS you can try calling Polymershapes. They have offices in multiple locations and can quote Lexan 25C and 460.

Fred.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:57 pm 

Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2012 11:22 pm
Posts: 66
Location: York, PA
jayrod wrote:
Is this unit used in freight service? Otherwise, it may be exempt from Part 223 requirements. Glazing meeting Part 223 is very expensive.


It's only going to be used for passenger service mostly, possibly freight service one day. The locomotive is currently equipped with Part 223 glazing. If we could get a waiver to use something cheaper, i'd be a happy person.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:40 pm 

Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:11 pm
Posts: 48
If it is fully compliant today then it probably has 3/8ths glass in the side sliders. Theres no quarter inch material that is compliant on it's own.

Fred


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 3:07 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:18 am
Posts: 132
Location: B'more MD
I believe that if a unit was equipped with FRA certified glazing, it should be repaired/replaced with similarly certified glazing. That is, not necessarily, the same manufacturer but with the same level of FRA Type I or Type II certification. It is certainly the case with passenger cars. Otherwise, as somebody has suggested, a waiver might be the only other option. I once asked about taking routing a piece of 3/8" polycarbonate Type II glazing to fit an existing 1/4" gasket, and the FRA person said that question hadn't been asked. I decided, in the end, not to ask the question and modify the frame to take righteous 3/8 Type II glazing using a new gasket.

_________________
George F.Payne
Baltimore, MD


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:04 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 11:06 am
Posts: 505
Location: NE PA
From the Federal register: see bold face
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2016-02-09/pdf/2016-02524.pdf
G. Locomotives, Passenger Cars, and Cabooses That Are More Than 50 Years Old But Built After 1945 and Equipped With Compliant Glazing
In connection with the changes to application of the term “antiquated equipment,” all locomotives, passenger cars, and cabooses more than 50 years old, but built after 1945 and equipped with glazing that complies with the glazing test standards in appendix A to part 223, must continue to comply with those standards. Broadening the definition of the term “antiquated equipment” in this rule does not diminish the level of safety currently required. Accordingly, FRA does not intend for windows currently complying with the impact test standards in appendix A to part 223 to be replaced with windows that are not. Moreover, given that such equipment would already have the necessary framing arrangements in place to support part 223-compliant glazing, FRA expects the window panels to be replaced with like window glazing. Of course, if equipment built after 1945 that is more than 50 years old is not already fitted with compliant window glazing, then such window panels (along with their supporting, framing arrangements) do not have to be installed.

It is just not the glazing but also the retaining frame/ gasket that must comply.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:29 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:54 am
Posts: 889
Location: New Franklin, OH
For reference, the following is 223.3 as the final rule is written on what the rule applies to: https://ecfr.io/Title-49/Section-223.3.

_________________
Eric Schlentner
Orrville Railroad Heritage Society
Car Knocker, Gandy Dancer & Hog Jockey
https://orrvillerailroad.com


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:37 pm 

Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:11 pm
Posts: 48
Lots of good stuff to digest here just a few other thoughts. FRA type 1 front facing is half inch whether poly or glass. FRA type 2 side facing is 3/8ths glass or half inch poly in a single piece. The LIRR ran 460 half inch poly in the old Pullman cars for years. They just routed the edge to quarter inch to fit the frame and gasket with the extra material to the inside of the car. When we rewindowed the 2937 at HVRM back in 2013 we changed the gaskets and installed 3/8ths glass in the frame.

Or in the case of some passenger car windows you sandwich multiple sheets of 1/4 inch poly in a single frame to meet the spec I believe it takes 2 layers to meet the spec.

In a locomotive if FRA compliant it should already have 3/8ths glass in the side windows. I've never seen any quarter inch material that will meet the spec on it's own. While Palgard 25c may meet the drop test I doubt it will stop a bullet. If you want to use poly in a side slider go to 460 and rout the edge

Dynamic Metals can cut your pieces for you if you dont need a full sheet. You're probably looking at 150 to 200 for 460 poly in a 2x2 window. but you could save a few bucks by cutting it yourself. The stuff cuts like butter with good wood working tools. I think Total Plastics offers pre cut pieces you finish to size. Or the SABIC distributor Polymershapes offers full sheets.


Fred


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Looking for a supplier to purchase a sheet of Lexan 25C
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2020 12:56 pm 

Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 3:28 am
Posts: 23
Location: York, PA
Dave,

If you want to keep things "local", why not ask Plastic Fabricators, Inc. if they could help you out. Heck, if you explain what you're trying to do and that you're a non-profit, they may even discount or donate. The worst they can do is say, "No".

They're located on West College Avenue in West York.

https://plasticfabinc.com/

Hope this helps.

_________________
John Frantz

York, PA
Crossroads of the Maryland & Pennsylvania, Pennsylvania and Western Maryland Railroads.


Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


 Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Al Stangenberger, firefighter25dfd, Google [Bot], philip.marshall, PMC, Steve A W, ZOBEX and 79 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: