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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:17 am 

Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:34 am
Posts: 538
Location: Granby, CT but formerly Port Jefferson, NY (LIRR MP 57.5)
70000 wrote:
I believe the Nene Valley Railway do have a "Thomas" that is exempt from any licensing fees, due to permission being granted, in pepertuity, by the Revd Awdry himself.


Who holds the copyright to Thomas et al.? Does it still belong to the Awdry estate, or is there some bigger corporate entity involved now?

-Philip Marshall


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:00 am 

Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:28 am
Posts: 642
Location: Ipswich, UK
philip.marshall wrote:
70000 wrote:
I believe the Nene Valley Railway do have a "Thomas" that is exempt from any licensing fees, due to permission being granted, in pepertuity, by the Revd Awdry himself.


Who holds the copyright to Thomas et al.? Does it still belong to the Awdry estate, or is there some bigger corporate entity involved now?

-Philip Marshall


The Thomas brand has passed through several Commercial concerns since the early 1980's.
It started with Britt Allcroft/Gullane Entertainment, which were both UK based, then passing to HiT Entertainment, a US/UK Company.
The ownership seems to be with Mattel now, which is purely a US concern, I believe.

Don't think the Awdry Family have any input at all nowadays, and it has basically become an International money making brand which, may have a potential declining market.
The original books were still popular in the 1960's (although I only ever had 2 of them, the Chuffalong/Sammy the Shunter ones outnumbering them many times) though they had become less popular by the 70's, which is when Britt Allcroft came on the scene and revitalised the "product".

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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:46 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 5:05 pm
Posts: 1232
How many avid steam fans got started watching Thomas? There are probably many adult fans now who grew up thinking Ring Star was famous for being Mr. Conductor. Thomas has had a good long run but everything passes.


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:57 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:51 pm
Posts: 2043
Location: Southern California
70000 wrote:
The Thomas brand has passed through several Commercial concerns since the early 1980's.
It started with Britt Allcroft/Gullane Entertainment, which were both UK based, then passing to HiT Entertainment, a US/UK Company.
The ownership seems to be with Mattel now, which is purely a US concern, I believe.
I am under the impression that while the ownership is with Mattel, one or more of the previous firms still exist as a subsidiary of Mattel.

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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:13 am 
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 9:05 pm
Posts: 1054
Location: MA
A funny note about ownership. There was a guy on YouTube who made a parody combining Thomas the Tank Engine with Transformers. Staring Op"Thomas" Prime. This was obviously a parody and he even said he got good reviews from the people that Hit. However he eventually got a DCMA notice. This was around the time Mattel bought hit. Mattel's archrival competitor is Hasbro, who owns the trademark to Transformers. So I do not think the timing of the DCMA notice was coincidental.


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:58 am 

Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 5:26 pm
Posts: 612
Location: Pure Michigan
Britt Allcroft resigned from her own company after "Thomas and the Magic Railroad" (2000) bombed at the box office in both the US and Europe. Gullane Entertainment (originally The Britt Allcroft Company), was acquired by HIT Entertainment in 2002. HIT Entertainment was then subsequently acquired by Mattel in 2012.


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:21 pm 

Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 12:45 pm
Posts: 142
LVRR2095 wrote:
wonder what will become of the converted BEDT locomotive once Thomas is off the air and no longer pulling in audiences and making money....now that the original cab and saddle tank are no longer around.


Fabricating those components from scratch if needed wouldn't be cheap, but it would certainly be doable either by Strasburg or another competent fabrication shop.


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:42 pm 

Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2004 2:50 pm
Posts: 2815
Location: Northern Illinois
Hate to say it, but BEDT 15 has been seen by way more people as Thomas than ever saw it working the docks, and has become an icon in its own right in its blue iteration. The case could be made to preserve it as Thomas, as an example of mass hysteria... sorry, the media and it's interpretation of railroading in the late twentieth century.

Anyway, correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't there other BEDT engines that have been preserved?

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Last edited by Dennis Storzek on Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:47 pm 

Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 5:26 pm
Posts: 612
Location: Pure Michigan
Dennis Storzek wrote:
Anyway, correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't there other BEDT engines that have been preserved?


Quite a few actually:

#12 at Florida Gulf Coast Railroad Museum, Willow, Flordia
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aem-7_alp-44/36973391964

#13 at Age of Steam Roundhouse, Sugarcreek, Ohio (Picture is from when it was at Railroad Museum of Pennsylvania)
https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/loc ... 0710011425

#14 at Ulster & Delaware RR Historical Society, Arkville, New York
https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/loc ... 0829005450

#16 at Railroad Museum of Long Island, Riverhead, New York
https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/fileSendA ... /image.jpg


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:26 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:34 am
Posts: 538
Location: Granby, CT but formerly Port Jefferson, NY (LIRR MP 57.5)
For those not in the know, photos of BEDT No. 15 in pre-Thomas form can be found here:

http://members.trainweb.com/bedt/bedt/BEDT15.html

Yes, saddletank Porter 0-6-0Ts were commonplace, but I think she was quite an elegant engine.

-Philip Marshall


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:53 pm 

Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:11 pm
Posts: 47
Did "Thomas" ever run when in Ohio? Its sale predates my first visit to that operation.


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:18 pm 

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:02 pm
Posts: 1751
Location: Back in NE Ohio
LiveWire wrote:
Did "Thomas" ever run when in Ohio? Its sale predates my first visit to that operation.


Yes, the CVSR used it at least a couple of times early in their Day Out With Thomas events, but it's been at least six or seven years since they did. They then later used what was left on the coal pile at Boston MIlls for either OC #1293 or NKP #765 for Steam in the Valley, but I think the last few years Ft. Wayne has brought their own coal in gons with them.


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 8:55 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 6:30 am
Posts: 758
filmteknik wrote:
Live steam Thomas should be just as moveable as the Gramling engines. Maybe the licensor should be hooked up with Trucker Dave.

The replicas are considerably lighter than the live steam Thomas. They're designed that way so they can easily be trucked. As a result when you ride in the cab it's like riding in a tin can. Noisy and rough.


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:02 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 6:30 am
Posts: 758
John T wrote:
How many avid steam fans got started watching Thomas? There are probably many adult fans now who grew up thinking Ring Star was famous for being Mr. Conductor. Thomas has had a good long run but everything passes.

Ringo is part owner of the Thomas franchise. Richard Starkey's name appears in the Day Out With Thomas contract. At least it did a few years ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Thomas the Tank engine
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:47 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm
Posts: 1501
Count me in as a Railfan who grew up watching Ringo Star narrate the early Thomas films.

I've worked Thomas events with both the steam and non-steam versions. The steam version gets a lot more respect from the adults (parents, grandparents, etc.) that come to the event. It's always important to think bigger picture. Yes, the replica Thomas is cheaper and the "kids don't know the difference" (even though some of them do). But which version impresses many first time adult visitors to your "historical" attraction?


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