Catskill Mountain Railroad Fighting for it's Future, Again.

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2892

NJDixon wrote:

I was also assuming they'd be looking at consolidating with D&U, since D&U has said they hope to reopen the Arkville-Rpxbury line again and push past Fleishmanns, and consolidation with CMRR would bring another operational engine to help operate two routes, a collection of cars, and more hands to work. The downside is that I know D&U is isolated from the rail network, and I believe CMRR is, so you're moving everything by truck.

It sounds like they have had enough of Ulster county. As for moving their equipment out, Catskill Mountain RR had a few cars dropped at a siding on CSX in Kingston, and then moved the cars down city streets using a set of semi-trailer wheels and a fifth wheel that connected to the drawbar pockets, but that was only a few blocks.

Does any of the U&D toward Oneonta still exist?

Randy Gustafson · **Posted:** Tue May 13, 2025 11:37 am

The Oneonta end of the railroad started getting abandoned about 1965. I'm not sure how far the rail still goes north from Arkville, maybe all the way to Roxbury but not operational that far.

What you have to remember is that this was an EPIC climb up from the Hudson River at Roundout; the top of the hill at Fleischmanns was at 1885' at milepost 42 or so. If you've ever driven down 28 going downhill, you wonder to yourself how the railroad ever made it up here, let alone before air brakes! You're dragging it up that 2% grade most of the way, and it hits 3.2% just over the summit on both sides.

The county line is just back a bit from the summit leaving the U&D passing siding at Highmount in Ulster County. From here to Phoenicea was the worst flood damage, the subroadbed was entire gone in many places. The railbike operation is still alive and well from Phoenicia south toward Cold Brook (Rail Explorers)

The truly ironic part is that the Arkville part of the world has made peace with a rail-with-trail philosophy for decades (different county - Delaware), the Kingston trolley museum track has a trail right beside it out to Kingston Point, and it's like none of that exists. It's one of the most difficult political environments I've ever seen.

And even after pulling in over 60,000 riders in 2024, you can go on to the Ulster County Tourism website, and it's not even mentioned.

I've also found it amusing that the CBS sitcom "Ghosts" is fictionally set in Ulster County, and the various problems the Inn owners have with locals, politicians, and the press just trying to run a business....well, it's obvious somebody has spent some time there.

NJDixon · **Joined:** Mon Dec 06, 2021 4:36 pm **Posts:** 376

Randy Gustafson wrote:

The Oneonta end of the railroad started getting abandoned about 1965. I'm not sure how far the rail still goes north from Arkville, maybe all the way to Roxbury but not operational that far.

What you have to remember is that this was an EPIC climb up from the Hudson River at Roundout; the top of the hill at Fleischmanns was at 1885' at milepost 42 or so. If you've ever driven down 28 going downhill, you wonder to yourself how the railroad ever made it up here, let alone before air brakes! You're dragging it up that 2% grade most of the way, and it hits 3.2% just over the summit on both sides.

Are the rails still intact at the wild double horseshoe curve between Pine Hill and Highmount? It kind of looks like it on Google maps, albeit lifted at the grade crossings. I found discussions on converting that part into a rail trail back in 2021.

Daylight25 · **Joined:** Wed Mar 23, 2022 11:00 pm **Posts:** 187

Here's a fun update, someone vandalized some of the equipment

Trains Magazine Article: https://www.trains.com/trn/news-reviews ... -sabotage/

Randy Gustafson · **Posted:** Fri Jun 27, 2025 11:29 am

That press photo shows another 'fun fact' you're stuck with dealing with Ulster County. The County owns the right-of-way, and there is a county ordinance prohibiting the use of any herbicide on county-owned land.
https://ulstercountyny.gov/sites/defaul ... 202009.pdf

That gets interesting when you can't do anything except physically mow your ROW. Don't blame the railroad for that turf track around the inserter. While the FRA doesn't get explicit in vegetation other than it cannot "interfere with railroad employees performing normal trackside duties" that can be interpreted at preventing proper track inspection.

CMRR has had a variety of very creative on-track mowers over the years....

Chris Webster · **Joined:** Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am **Posts:** 1097

A January 1, 2026 Facebook post from the City of Kingston Fire Department:

Quote:

Locomotive Fire – Kingston Plaza Area

At approximately 03:00 last night, the Kingston Fire Department responded to a reported locomotive fire in the area of the Kingston Plaza.

Firefighters arrived quickly and worked for approximately two hours to bring the incident under control. We are pleased to report that no injuries occurred as a result of this incident.

The cause of the fire remains under investigation by the Kingston Fire Department Fire Investigation Division.

We thank our firefighters for their swift and professional response and appreciate the cooperation of the public during the incident.

Further updates will be provided if additional information becomes available.

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Steamguy73 · **Joined:** Wed Dec 24, 2014 3:15 pm **Posts:** 636

At a certain point it all feels rather fishy. What exactly is fishy you may ask? I'll stray away from any potential libel.

Chris Webster · **Joined:** Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am **Posts:** 1097

A January 5, 2026 article in The Daily Freeman:

Quote:

KINGSTON, N.Y. — A city resident was charged with arson in connection with a fire on a Catskill Mountain Railroad Company locomotive on New Year’s Day, but he does not appear to have targeted the railroad, Lt. Patrick Buono said on Monday.

John J. Dwyer, 25, of Kingston, was arrested at about 5:15 a.m. Friday, Jan. 2, for allegedly setting a fire in the cab of Locomotive #400.

While investigating the Thursday, Jan. 1, blaze, police said they determined that Dwyer set a fire “in the cab of the locomotive,” Buono said in an email.

Buono said, “It does not appear that this act was directed at Catskill Mountain Railroad.”
However, additional arrests are expected, Buono said.

Article also says the suspect was released by Kingston City Court with a return date of Thursday, January 8.

Link to the paywalled article: Kingston man charged over Catskill Mountain Railroad locomotive fire

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2892

Eyes New Home: https://railfan.com/new-york-tourist-ra ... -new-home/

Randy Gustafson · **Posted:** Tue Feb 17, 2026 5:42 pm

Digging around in the digital swamp, I found this nugget....

"Sustainable tourism". What this is is a rather thinly-veiled plan to deliberately REDUCE tourism in an area like Ulster County.
https://participate.ulstercountyny.gov/ ... le-tourism

You have to see the comments. I've seen it firsthand in meetings myself.

Increase the hotel taxes to keep people out. No more trails, either, as they have increased traffic on 28 to the Reservoir. "

You thought the trails people were tough? Try that group out.

To remind people of just how difficult it is to run an excursion railroad there, the comment 'what happens if we depend on tourism and there is another pandemic???' Never mind that CMRR ran everybody in open cars and stayed open when most closed and bailed.

Most communities are struggling in the post-industrial era to develop a solid visitor tourism element. It must be nice to even not want that anymore.

You thought California was tough!

NJDixon · **Joined:** Mon Dec 06, 2021 4:36 pm **Posts:** 376

Well, the county voted to remove the Basin Road Bridge. Time to see if CMRR will uphold their threat to leave Ulster County.

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2892

The first place that comes to mind as a potential destination in New York State is the other end of the original Delaware and Ulster, the Ulster and Delaware RR, which I would bet is their preferred destination if they could work out an agreement, but unfortunately it too is cut off from the national system, and is further away from NYC's population. The second destination I think is plausible is the old Lowville and Beaver River RR, which is intact, and could be reconnected to the national system with a bridge repair, but unfortunately it too is owned by a county that wants to turn it into a trail. I think leaving New York entirely might be a good idea. The biggest issue is to own one's own track and not rely on a municipality not changing their mind at some point down the line.

jayrod · **Posted:** Fri Feb 20, 2026 12:39 am

The kicker is that if you move too far away, you start losing staff and volunteers.

Pat Fahey · **Posted:** Fri Feb 20, 2026 8:42 am

Hi
It's too bad no solution can't be found,, on this problem,, but reading the posts and it looks like the city just wants to wash it hands and make the railroad just go away..
I have only ridden the railroad once being from Massachusetts, I was on vacation doing some railfaning in New York state,, and decided to take a ride.. to help support the railroad.
At that time I was lucky enough to get a cab ride without asking for it,, but that's another story..
I don't know how much revenue the railroad brought it to the city during the tourist season,, that question only the city and railroad can only answer..
Yes it was shame to read about the cab fire, that should have not happened,, but they found the person that caused the fire..
I don't know all the politics between the city and the railroad,, other railroad museums have moved and found new volunteers and also a better location over the years..
Yes it takes time to find a new location where the railroad would be welcome,,along with all the equipment... yes the railroad will have to start all over again,, and yes where ever the railroad moves too it will get ( Not in my Backyard opposition) ..
When the Grafton & Upton RR was brought by the new owners here in Massachusetts it faced the same problem..
I do hope the Catskill Mountain railroad does find a new location, to where they are welcome, and does face the same problem to where they are now,, Good Luck on the railroads new home once it is found.. Pat.

cjvrr · **Posted:** Fri Feb 20, 2026 10:19 am

There is an out of service line over in Beacon, I believe owned by Metro North that would make a decent location.

But would it happen with Metro North being the owner?

I believe the Housatonic has the freight right on it at this time.