I understand the economics, but I morn the loss of the real steam Thomas at most events. What better way to expose a whole new generation to the wonders of steam than with our little blue friend?

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I agree wholeheartedly, as the former BEDT tank that became Thomas was the first live steam locomotive I ever saw. The nice crew "giving him a drink" (filling the tanks) the evening before his debut trains at Cuyahoga Valley were happy to answer any questions about how Thomas made the steam that let him pull and push the train. Pretty amazing experience for a Thomas loving kid who was getting more and more into the 'bigger trains'.

Live steam Thomas should be just as moveable as the Gramling engines. Maybe the licensor should be hooked up with Trucker Dave.

I don't believe the ability to move the locomotive is the issue - rather, that railroads not only have to pay to have Thomas come - but also the various licensing fees to the various Thomas-related companies (HIT, or Mattel, etc) in addition to souvenirs, vendors, tents, etc. When you add all those in, I can understand why most railroads would want to save money and use the "dummy" Thomas locomotives instead of the extra expense to have the real one there.

Not that I like it at all - but I understand it.

Yeah, but cost of licensing, merchandise, etc. is the same whether you run the steam Thomas or the Charlie McCarthy version.

The real Issue, other than increased cost of trucking, is having to provide a steam qualified crew, or pay a crew to come with the engine. With Thomas as an empty box, the hosting group can just use their usual power and operating crews.

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The July 2013 issue of TRAINS magazine had an excellent article on the Gramlings and their engines. I've attached a screenshot of a portion of one page from that article which should answer your question.

I don't know the exact figures, but bringing in live steam Thomas costs several times more than one of the "shoving platform" versions. Given the cut that the promoters get overall for putting on the event, any savings to the host railroad's bottom line can make or break the event for them, especially if they don't have other big promotions - like a Santa or Polar Express event. And most four and five year olds really don't know the difference. Little foamers like me would have, but as has been pointed out here numerous times, there's not enough of us to matter to a tourist operation.

Which is about 3/4 the weight given for BEDT 14, 128,000 pounds. Kelly, what is the final shipping weight for the steam Thomas?

My organization used the "live steam" Thomas for its early Thomas events. There were two issues with it: the engine didn't have the pulling power to reliably haul the length of train that our customer demand required, and the need to water the engine periodically cut down on the number of trips it could make (also a customer demand issue). At least at our organization, the event works much better with the "dummy" Thomas engine. Also, in recent years, the "dummy" engines have been equipped with technology that makes them "talk", and their faces & eyes move, all of which are attractive to little kids. Of course, die hard steam buffs will cringe at all of this. But the Thomas event isn't for them. It's for little kids who are absolutely delighted to see their cartoon characters in person. Whether the train is actually being "pulled" by Thomas or is being pushed a diesel at the rear of the train makes no difference to a 5 year old.

By the way, around customers, we always refer to the pusher diesel as the "Thomas helper."

Thomas came to the Northwest Ry Museum about six weeks early this year due to canceled engagements. He was stored at Snoqualmie until his runs last weekend and next. This was the first year that the Thomas event did not sell out in advance. Declining interest in Thomas will cause many to look for other profit centers.

Which leads me to wonder what will become of the converted BEDT locomotive once Thomas is off the air and no longer pulling in audiences and making money....now that the original cab and saddle tank are no longer around.

For those that don't follow these things it actually really has become a general consensus that "Thomas the Tank Engine" has finally run it's course and is dropping out of popularity. Despite what you see at Wal-Mart the toys aren't selling like they used to and Mattel has been making a lot of what can be considered "desperation plays" to keep the franchise going. They've moved him off PBS and sold the airing rights to Nickelodeon (a network that itself is dying a slow death) and are now completely retooling the show trying to keep it relevant.

It wouldn't surprise me that in the next couple of years you see a sharp decline (way sharper than now) in attendance at these events. The drawback is going to be that too many organizations are going to keep betting their whole year on it until the year comes when it tanks and kills the groups finances off.

I think the program should have been kept on PBS. It needs to be some place in front of the largest audience.
I read the same sort of observations about 10 years ago in a British railfan publication. I just don't know what the situation is currently there in Great Britain.

A lot of railways dropped out of hosting Thomas events when the fees for hosting such things were hiked up a few years back. Lines like the Great Central have diversified further into events featuring "Superheros"(various ones available..), "Peppa Pig" and "Paw Patrol" that seem to bring in good attendances.
One line even converted an 0-4-0T to resemble "Ivor the Engine", an animated British TV programme from the 1960's & 70's, though that loco is currently up for sale.....

Other locos with faces are available here - "Chuffalong" and "Sammy the Shunter" were 2 from the 1960's (I've got some of the books somewhere...) but, surprisingly. nobody has attempted to resurrect them - though, presumably, the current Thomas brand owners may huff and puff over that if somebody did!

I believe the Nene Valley Railway do have a "Thomas" that is exempt from any licensing fees, due to permission being granted, in pepertuity, by the Revd Awdry himself.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, Hornby are dropping their OO electric Thomas range later this year due to demand changes. Whether Bachmann will step in with their version (which they cant legally sell here at the moment) is another matter.