And I just remembered, CNR 6213 received a set of pressure sensitive vinyl decals on her tender back in 1985. They are a bit faded after 27 years, but still in decent shape.

We have used both methods over the years. By far, the best results we've had is using the method that Gerald (wm303) describes on his SD's. We've used the 3 ply vinyl stencils on 3 locomotive paint jobs since 2010. We use lettering enamel which is brushed on straight out of the can. The time differential between using the vinyl as stencils vs. final product is minimal, it only takes about 30 minutes to paint in a road name. The lettering weathers pretty much at the same rate as the underlying paint, and does not peel or crack. Below are photos of work we were doing today using this method.

http://www.facebook.com/messages/131849 ... =3&theater

http://www.facebook.com/messages/131849 ... =3&theater

We are going with vinyl lettering on 6069 including the large CNR herald on the tender. So far the lettering on the rear of the tender has stood up to 2 years of sun and weather and still looks fresh and clean with no curling of the edges or anthing.

Just tried my vinyl masks i had made from my original drawings taken from a 1890 Pullman works photograph. Very impressed with the clean lines and ease of application on a wood surface.

Mike Pannell
Car 57

Whether you use vinyl or paint will depend a lot on your circumstances, talent and finances. I have use both on the same car, and I'm happy with the results. If the choice is between a non or poorly lettered project, and vinyl, go with the vinyl. It's nothing that can be redone at some point if a purest comes along to do the work. There are too many projects out there which need attention. I'd rather have 2 or 3 good looking cars, than one "perfect, in every - nobody will ever know the difference - fashion." 3 ply stencils and vinyl help tell the story, and that's more inportant than the paint vs. vinyl question in my mind. Are the paint only advocates making sure the paint has the proper percentage of white lead???

I don't know... I don't think even a paint chemist will be able to tell the amount of white lead in the paint simply by visual inspection. On the other hand, I think even the most casual observer would say that this isn't paint:



Worse, is the question, "Did old time railroad equipment always have peeling lettering?"

If we want to preserve the relic, and it has to stay out in the weather, I should think we want to preserve it in a fashion where at any point in its life cycle it looks like it would have looked in service.

Some background on the sign. This was made up about twenty years ago for a show display. It is red self adhesive vinyl on yellow Sintra, which I believe is a foamed PVC sheet. About twelve or fifteen years ago the sign became surplus, and was re-purposed as our front door sign.

Now, since it was originally done as a show display, I have no idea if it was supposed to be weather resistant, or UV proof. Obviously, it isn't. It's never been outside, but inside the glass on a south exposure. These last several years it has been going downhill fast... one of these days I'm going to have to replace it. The little red slivers are pieces of the lettering that are now flaking off, and sticking to the glass due to "static cling" The chip out of the corner of the Sintra is due to the fact that Nylon cable ties don't have a very long life expectancy under these conditions, either.

This may not be a viable test, because this may not be the same material as the truck lettering available these days. Then again, we all know what kind of life we can expect out of 1 Shot lettering enamel; even more out of sprayed on automotive finishes.

Considering one can get either the lettering or stencil cut for the same money, and the paint takes just a day longer, I personally think it's silly to risk having the lettering fail after just a dozen or so years when paint will easily last three times as long.

2 things:

1: There are quite a few different grades of vinyl... some won't last a year in the sun. As you said, you don't know what grade of vinyl the sign was made with, but if it was made for a show display it was probably made with the cheapest crappiest vinyl available.

2: How do you think paint looks after 20 years in the sun? I know formulations have changed dramatically in the post-lead age, but I've seen a lot of peeling paint in my day. It seems that today's paint formulas aren't as hardy as the old lead stuff but I'm no expert.

In any case my only point was that I agree profusely with your statement that your sign is not a great example of what is preferable.

My take on it is this: if you need it fast and cheap, you can get cheap vinyl and it's REALLY CHEAP. It won't last longer than a couple years tho. For long lasting, it seems like there are pros and cons to high-grade vinyl vs. paint.

The tech paper I went through on Scotchcal 220 outdoor vinyl guarantees eight-year lifetime on vertical outdoor surfaces. The warranty excludes horizontal (facing the sky), high temperature, multiple layers as this sign was. I have a Milwaukee Herald I made with 220 in my garage 15 years ago that looks great. The reflective I put on the IRM Turbine is starting to peel at the edges on the south (sunny) side after 9 years. And the oil based enamel paint is also looking pretty shabby. So the data looks real, minimum 8 years outside in the sun as long as the surface is OK.

The problem is, eight years is just a blink of the proverbial eye in Railway Preservation... heck, that's hardly long enough to get the brushes cleaned and put away. And if the paint is looking shabby in that short period, either something is wrong with the paint (thank Uncle Sam for that) or with the surface prep. I assume that IRM will be able to see its way clear to get the unit repainted in another twenty or so years. Imagine what the paint and visages of the peeled off lettering will look like by then.

I've seen a lot of paint failures over the years, but the one thing I have not seen is good lettering enamel peel off the base coat. The fact that that failure is so rare is what makes vinyl lettering so bad... when it starts to peel, it gives itself away. Remember what I said about wanting the artifact to look like it did in service all through its life?

Let me call your attention to IRM's three "Boonton" cars. All three were repainted in the early seventies. John McKelvey and I did one of the cars, 556, IIRC, with Ditzler DQE enamel, and then it was decided to use the donated custom matched Rustoleum Pullman green on the other two. All were lettered with 1 Shot.

Here's the finish on the 556 after almost forty years of weather exposure:



Here is the 561, which seems to be experiencing a failure of the finish coat:



And here is the 567:



Odd, but I don't seem to see any of that lettering peeling off.