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| Need rail section identification https://rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=5978 |
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| Author: | Howard P. [ Wed Jun 04, 2003 11:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Need rail section identification |
RMNE is getting a donation of siding rail from a local industry. The web is marked "Bethlehem Open Hearth 100 B II 1915" (Feb. 1915), and the section is 5.5" base, 2.75" wide head, just under 6" height (a couple 16ths under). I looked it up in an extensive listing I have of rail sections, and could not find it... ARA-B does not match the dimensions, and that's the only "100 B" I could find. Do any of you know what rail section this is, who used it, etc.? hpincus@mindspring.com |
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| Author: | Brian Bastow [ Thu Jun 05, 2003 9:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
The only section I can find besides 100 ARA-A is 100 NH which was used by the NY. NH&H. > RMNE is getting a donation of siding rail > from a local industry. The web is marked > "Bethlehem Open Hearth 100 B II > 1915" (Feb. 1915), and the section is > 5.5" base, 2.75" wide head, just > under 6" height (a couple 16ths under). > I looked it up in an extensive listing I > have of rail sections, and could not find > it... ARA-B does not match the dimensions, > and that's the only "100 B" I > could find. > Do any of you know what rail section this > is, who used it, etc.? brianbastow@stoneconsulting.com |
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| Author: | Howard P. [ Thu Jun 05, 2003 9:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
> The only section I can find besides 100 > ARA-A is > 100 NH which was used by the NY. NH&H. Being in Connecticut, we know the 100-107 NH sections with our eyes closed!! Our Naugatuck Railroad has 12+ miles of that stuff. This 100-B is a real mystery. Thanks to those who have replied with info on various rail sections. hpincus@mindspring.com |
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| Author: | James F. Boylan [ Thu Jun 05, 2003 1:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
> the section is 5.5" base, 2.75" wide head, just under 6" height (a couple 16ths under). < L. B. Foster's extensive table (on page I-35 of their catalog) gives those dimensions for 100 lb. A(merican)R(ailway)A(ssociation)-A and also 100 lb. N(ew)Y(ork).N(ew)H(aven) &H(artford). For both sections, the new hight was 6 inches. The most obvious difference between the 2 is the elevation of the bolt hole center from the bottom of the base: NY.NH&H = 2-39/64 ARA-A = 2-3/4 (2-48/64) Since the difference in Fishing Depth (where the splice bars go) is only 1/32", the bars are probably physically interchangable. See if the bolt hole spacing on original (not torch cut) rail end holes matches New Haven standards. (I hope someone saved the New Haven's M of W standards book, I only have Pennsy and Reading books.) 100B is probably Bethlehem Steel's part number. In Pennsylvania, we encounter a lot of 100K, which is Bethlehem's number for 100 lb. P(hiladelphia)&R(eading) and 100 lb. R(eading)C(ompany). A rail company called "Maryland" (now Bethlehem's Sparrows Point?) used 3 digit part numbers. TyburnRR@cs.com |
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| Author: | Alan Maples [ Thu Jun 05, 2003 3:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
An interesting mystery. My list of Bethlehem rail sections includes 100, 100A, 100C, 100D, 100E, 100F, 100G, 100K, 100-OM, 100GN . . . and no 100 B. Cambria Steel did list the 100 NYNH-H as 100B. Alan Maples AMaples@aol.com |
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| Author: | Erik Ledbetter [ Thu Jun 05, 2003 8:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
> A rail company called "Maryland" > (now Bethlehem's > Sparrows Point?) used 3 digit part numbers. Affarmative on Maryland Steel = Sparrws Point. From the Beth Steel Coporate History: 1916 - E.G. Grace named president of Bethlehem with C.M. Schwab continuing as chairman of the board. Bethlehem acquires American Iron & Steel Mfg. Co., Pennsylvania Steel Co. and Maryland Steel Co. with steel operations in Lebanon and Steelton, Pa., and Sparrows Point, Md., coal mines in West Virginia and iron ore mines in Pennsylvania. eledbetter@rypn.org |
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| Author: | Howard P. [ Thu Jun 05, 2003 10:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Eureka!!! |
> An interesting mystery. My list of Bethlehem > rail sections includes 100, 100A, 100C, > 100D, 100E, 100F, 100G, 100K, 100-OM, 100GN > . . . and no 100 B. > Cambria Steel did list the 100 NYNH-H as > 100B. > Alan Maples Once again, "Interchange" proves its worth!!! Locos, cars, debates about "real vs. replica", even track!!! Alan: You got it.... considering the location of the "100 B" stuff, it's probably 100 NH from an "alternate" vendor. Did Beth Steel take over Cambria? James B.: From the overall dimensions, it looked like it would mate with 100-107 NH easily... and I suspect the drilling is the same, too. One of our guys has most of an NYNH&H track standards book, rather dog-eared, but quite useful. Not everything we'd like to know is in there, but enough good stuff is. The 100 NH is generally older, from 1898 to about 1915. The 107 NH dates go from 1915 or so up to 1929. The 107 NH is 1/8" higher than the 100 NH, but once the stuff is worn, it makes little difference. Thanks, guys. hpincus@mindspring.com |
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| Author: | Erik Ledbetter [ Thu Jun 05, 2003 10:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Eureka!!! |
> Did Beth Steel take over Cambria? Yes: 1923 - Bethlehem acquires Cambria Steel Co. and Midvale Steel & Ordnance Co. with steel operations and coal mines in the Johnstown, Pa., area. eledbetter@rypn.org |
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| Author: | k.bush [ Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
Can anyone tell me what is the equivalent size of Maryland 235 to AREMA standards? |
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| Author: | Larry Lovejoy [ Fri Oct 26, 2012 12:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
Maryland 235 is the same thing as 85 ASCE. AREMA no longer exercises any jurisdiction over rails that weigh less than 115 pounds per yard. /s/ Larry Lawrence G Lovejoy, P.E. |
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| Author: | k.bush [ Fri Oct 26, 2012 2:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
Thank you. AREMA only showed 236 and 237 equivalents. |
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| Author: | Richard W. [ Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
Howard, Here is the data I'm showing for New Haven 100# rail. Richard Wilkens NYNH&H 100 Illinois Steel - 10034/10044 Tennesee - 10034 Carnegie - 10034/100N Lackawanna - 1002 Bethlehem - 100B/100NH Maryland Steel - 100 Profile Data Height - 6.0000 Base - 5.5000 Head - 2.7500 Web - 0.5938 Depth of Base - 0.9375 Fishing - 3.3438 Depth of Head - 1.7188 |
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| Author: | Richard W. [ Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
Here are the different roll marks for 85 ASCE Richard Wilkens Illinois - 8540/8504 Tennessee - 8540/850 Carnegie - 8540/85A Cambria - 531 Bethlehem - 85A/235 Maryland - 235 Lackawanna - 850 Colorado - 851 Algoma - 124 Dominion - 8503 |
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| Author: | dinwitty [ Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
OEM vendors even back then...heh I was thinking check with the donor tracks connections that these rails were connected to for adapting ideas, not this group has already the wherewithall to idea-ize that, sounds like a cost cutting thing by the original buyer. |
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| Author: | hamster [ Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need rail section identification |
Richard W. wrote: Howard, Here is the data I'm showing for New Haven 100# rail. Richard Wilkens NYNH&H 100 Illinois Steel - 10034/10044 Tennesee - 10034 Carnegie - 10034/100N Lackawanna - 1002 Bethlehem - 100B/100NH Maryland Steel - 100 Profile Data Height - 6.0000 Base - 5.5000 Head - 2.7500 Web - 0.5938 Depth of Base - 0.9375 Fishing - 3.3438 Depth of Head - 1.7188 I have serious trouble with RAIL dimensions to the "nearest" TEN THOUSANDTH of an inch. This is RAIL, not aircraft parts after all! I doubt that the original specifications were any more accurate than the nearest 5 thousandths. And without a doubt when manufactured these rails were lucky to be much less than +/-30 thousandths of the standard dimensions. |
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