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| Northeast Missouri Old Threshers https://rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=27232 |
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| Author: | Jeff Terry [ Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Northeast Missouri Old Threshers |
The past few days I've been working on the list of operable US/Canadian steam for 2009 (to be published in the July 2009 issue of Railfan & Railroad). I learned about this group last year, and listed their engine for 2008. It now looks as if they've purchased a tender (perhaps from the Monticello RR Museum?). I've been looking at some of the photos they've posted of the operation, and - gut feeling - I'm a little concerned. For example, I don't like the look of that water glass. Am I out of line here? This group seems well intentioned, but perhaps they have more experience with steam tractors than steam locomotives. Take a look for yourself: http://www.cardinals.k12.mo.us/staff/bsmith/train.htm |
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| Author: | AlderGulch12 [ Thu Mar 26, 2009 11:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Northeast Missouri Old Threshers |
Railroaders stepping up to a traction engine can be a rather interesting experience. There does seem to be a different mindset when it comes to traction. If it's a large threshermans association, then they can run steam, no matter what the type. Do they have a steam school? What are the laws governing locomotives outside of FRA jurisdiction? What are the traction laws? These can help answer the question as well. As far as the locomotive there is a name for this type of endeavor "Rough and Tumble engineering". We railroaders shudder at the thought but it's this that kept the tractors running in the forests and the plains and still does today. Historical boilers are interesting and we're blessed to have groups of individuals still safely operating them at shows and museums. |
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| Author: | Mike Stillwell [ Thu Mar 26, 2009 12:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Northeast Missouri Old Threshers |
"Look Honey, I shrunk the locomotive!" Sorry, I had to... Mike Stillwell Buena Vista, VA. |
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| Author: | robertmacdowell [ Fri Mar 27, 2009 4:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Northeast Missouri Old Threshers |
AlderGulch12 wrote: What are the laws governing locomotives outside of FRA jurisdiction? That's a good question. My cursory read of http://law.justia.com/us/cfr/title49/49 ... 5.6.1.html (start halfway down) says FRA jurisdiction is what they say it is. "With the exception of self-contained urban rapid transit systems, FRA's statutory jurisdiction extends to all entities that can be construed as railroads... however... Based on its knowledge of where the safety problems were occurring ... FRA has decided ... to regulate something less than the total universe of railroads. In other words, if it's a railroad, FRA can regulate it if they see fit. They go deep into what exactly they choose to regulate. But it seems to turn on a phrase: "business guest". If your riders are other than business guests, they regulate you. Does a paid passenger count? |
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| Author: | Mark Jordan [ Fri Mar 27, 2009 8:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Northeast Missouri Old Threshers |
I can't find the water glass photo referred to.....someone please help me...? As someome who has experience with both FRA regulated steam locomotives and state regulated traction steam, I can assue everyone that there is a very large group of folks that preach safety and proper operating and maintenance standards for all historic steam...rails, cleats, propellers or whatever it has. Yes, there are some folks who still will skirt the mainstream and do whatever they please, but I think that those folks will be "hearded in" to proper practices soon. I'm participating in two steam schools the next two weekends in Tennessee and Indiana, and am pleased with the number of people who are willing to pay their $ to attend and learn. As far as I know, the RR community still does not have any "steam schools" and incidents HAVE happened recently that demonstrates that railroads are not exempt from needing qualified personnel. I don't know anything about this operation, and am also curious about their level of operation and maintenance. Mark Jordan |
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| Author: | Jdelhaye [ Fri Mar 27, 2009 8:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Northeast Missouri Old Threshers |
Mark Jordan wrote: I can't find the water glass photo referred to.....someone please help me...? Mark Jordan  Notice the water glass is totally unguarded, and standing more than a foot off the backhead, just waiting for the backswing of a shovel to go right through it. Jeff |
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| Author: | Mark Jordan [ Fri Mar 27, 2009 9:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Northeast Missouri Old Threshers |
Could you enlarge the photo please? (just joking....) I managed to click on the other photos to get them to enlarge too. I also photoshopped a few to lighten them up to see details. Sometimes I amaze myself that occasionally I CAN operate a computer! Thanks for the help! A agree. This little lokey needs a couple of tweaks. As far as the water glass, the connections aren't quite proper either... I can only hope that the proud crew is willing to learn. More fodder for the learning curve! I attended a steam school in Missouri a couple of years ago, and folks there were asking if I and my boss (who also attended at my beckoning) would come look at their traction engines to tell them what they needed to fix. The state apparently will not look at "historic" steam, and it is exempt from Missouri law/code. The owners/operators want inspection, but can't get it. I'm a state boiler inspector, and my boss is the KY chief inspector. Even if the FRA were to get involved, the FRA would need a "qualified" steam inspector in that area to conduct the inspection. Mark |
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| Author: | AlderGulch12 [ Fri Mar 27, 2009 12:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Northeast Missouri Old Threshers |
Is there any other statues regarding federal oversight? In my state for example: 50-74-306. Traction licenses. (1) The licenses named in 50-74-303 do not entitle the holder to operate a traction engine. (2) A person who is entrusted with the care and management of traction engines or boilers on wheels is required to pass an examination testing the person's competency to operate that class of machinery and procure a traction license. (3) A person who is entrusted with the care, management, and operation of steam locomotives not addressed by federal regulations is required to pass an examination testing the person's competency to operate that class of machinery and procure a traction license. (4) A traction license does not entitle its holder to operate any other class of steam machinery. In Montana that's a 480 hour license. The #12 is FRA compliant we don't have to be but we are. Makes things easier. I wish that all operatons regardless of where they sit with the FRA followed the FRA standards. It does feel odd stepping up to a locomotive that has one water glass and no boiler lagging. There are many threshermans associations that run steam railroads. Rollag, Rough and Tumble abd Mount Pleasant all have a steam railroad on the grounds. A quick YouTube search will show you these. |
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