Does anyone have information about this road?

I recently picked up a nice B&W Photo of a locomotive pulling water out of a stream. The locomotive is an 0-6-2 Steamer, with a long cab and slantback switching tender, the Locomotive number is 43 and she is pulling an open vestibule combine. The photo looks to have been taken in either the late fall or early spring, no snow on the ground, a mix of bare Deciduous & Conifer (possibly Fir) trees in the background.

The only reference to Grassy River Railroad, I can find, is one in northwest New York state. That one traveled the area just above Cranberry Lake, in what is now the Adirondack State Park, and one of the trails is on a portion of the RoW.

There is not much for towns in that area, so a combine almost looks out of place, except for going between logging camps.

Was their another GRRR? Was the GRRR Standard or Narrow gauge? When and where did it run? Anything left (Buildings, Equipment, etc...)?

THanks,

Rich Cizik

Do you mean "Grasse River"?
Try the link below. Hope this helps.
http://www.ginosrailpage.com/GRRR/index.html

The page on the Grasse River shows this gas-electric which appears to be a sister to Strasburg's Lancaster, Oxford & Southern No 10. Is it? Did this car survive?

If I recall correctly, that IS the Lancaster Oxford & Southern car. I believe Grasse River RR obtained it when the LO&S was abandoned and converted it to standard gauge. The LO&S scratch-built it as a gas-mechanical in the company shops. At some point it made its way to Strasburg.
J

I did a lot of work, in and around Canton, New York, county seat of St Lawrence Co. The Grasse River flows right through Canton, although the railroad in question ran further to the south and west of that town. On off time I would drive around exploring, and came across an amazing amount of old, abndoned artifacts, including small water power dams, towns, even sites of entire paper mills. Many of the early mills were sited in that area, near the trees used for pulpwood, and near local deposits of iron pyrite, which could be harvested to supply the sulfite liquor needed for manufacture of the paper. There is even a town site named PYRITES, reputed to be the home town of Tony Bennet.


Bob Kutella

One of the Taber books has a chapter covering the Emporium Lumber Company and the Grasse River Railroad. I don't have it in front of me, but I think it was "Whining Saws and Squealing Flanges (No. 6)" which is available from the Whistle Stop Shop at the Railroad Museum of Pennsylvania and can be ordered from them on line.

Alan Maples

After rechecking the photo, it looks like my eyes may have assumed some letters. The steam from the pump is covering a few letters in the first word.

First letter is right half is obscured, it is a square letter like a C or a G. Second letter is totally covered. letter 3 is deffinately an A, then there is a double S and the last letter is mostly obscured, but has a full left edge, so it could be an E.

So GRASSE is a possibility.

Any other ideas?

Also after really pulling apart the image, she might be an 0-6-0 (I referred to her as an 0-6-2 based on the note on the back). Steam is covering where the rear truck would be, I might be able to see a journal box through the steam, but looking under the locomotive, I see the backside of the front tender truck. Illuminated in the sun there is a tapered beam that looks to be in the correct location to be the side arm of the rear truck, but I can't be sure.

Boy that Steamer #60 looks a lot like the #43 in my photo. The boiler looks to be an exact match. Rounded ending of the smokebox, same order of topside equipment (stack, then bell, then sand dome, and then the steam dome). Steam chests are too tall, on #43 the counterweights were solid to the hub, there were fewer spokes on the #43 and the endbeam looks to be less then a foot in front of the chests on #43. Almost made me think that might have moved the trailing truck up to become the pilot,

The Combine on the Equipment page looks to match also, same trucks, same bends in the vestibule railing, same window count and relative placement. I can't be positive since my photo is from the other side, but she looks to be a match (at least to build plans).

Thanks,

Rich C.

Here is what Prof. Geo. W. Hilton has to say about this car ("American Narrow Gauge Railroads" pp.207):

"Several managements of narrow gauges built motor cars of their own. One of the most professional jobs was done by one of the least pretentious narrow gauges, the Lancaster, Oxford & Southern. Seeking a cheaper way to move mail and milk, the railroad in 1914 had one of its existing cars rebuilt as a gas-mechanical unit with two transmissions, joined by a geared connection through the king pin of the lead truck. Built approximately to standard-gauge dimensions, the car seated 46 and carried two tons of freight. The car could make the Oxford-Quarryville trip of 19.5 miles in an hour and five minutes. After abandonment of the railroad in 1919, the car was converted to standard gauge and operated by the Grasse River Railroad in upstate New York until 1960. It was subsequently run by the Strasburg Rail Road and the National Park Service. It survives in the Railroad Museum of Pennsylvania at Strasburg."

FWIW, I suspect Hilton mis-spoke slightly with regard to the mechanical connection. It seems likely that the transmissions were located back-to-back with one for directional control and the other for gear changes with the drive line connecting to the lead truck via a 90 degree geared connection through the king pin. Has anyone here seen this car at Strasburg or viewed it in operation? Does it still have the mechanical connection or was it converted to gas-electric at some point?
J

Was this car leased by the Wolfborough RR (NH) for a few years during the 1970s?

Yes, in fact that's where I know No 10 from. I found this photo on Nerail which shows her waiting on the passing track at Cotton Valley, the approximate mid-point on the Wolfeboro branch. I volunteered there during that era but never really knew the history of the car so this is a very nice surprise -- thanks. By the way rumor had it back then that No 10 had been re-motored with a police interceptor V-8!

Photo: Rick Libby

I believe that's my old friend Brian Carroll running fire patrol in the speeder that he rebuilt at 16 years old.

Rich, sorry to 'derail' your thread slightly, but as usual great memories courtesy of RyPN!

Stephen

.

Get this book--it has a full history with TONS of maps on the Grasse River, and as usual with a RR book by Michael Kudish, it is HIGHLY informative.

http://www.amazon.com/Mountain-Railroad ... 463&sr=8-8

Published by Purple Mountain Press.

My young kids fondly refer to this car as "Toby" having ridden on it many times at DOWT events.

Movie of it in action:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Vxq20Koi4D0

The early photo and patent show what appears to be radiator on the roof. One assumes it lost it during the remotor.

Bob