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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:10 am 

Joined: Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:54 pm
Posts: 314
I'll always say that Dollywood is one of the best examples of a steam locomotive working hard in the country. The ride is short, and the scenery is slowly getting removed in favor of "Dollyworld" but the line and grade is unchanged. 5.5-6% grade right off the bat, throttle wide open and on the verge of stalling almost every time out of downtown Dollywood. Dollywood is proof that steam and trains can survive in their natural form inside theme parks.


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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 3:02 am 

Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:28 am
Posts: 640
Location: Ipswich, UK
Kevin Gilliam wrote:
Richard Glueck wrote:
Why would you do that to a steam locomotive?


an attempt at saving money under the theory that 95% of the people wouldn't know the difference and the remainder wouldn't matter. Sad thing is that Six Flags did the same thing.

See picture below of the Stone Mountain dieselization....
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I hadn't realised that there were other "powerpack" conversions of steam locos like that.

I came across this one at the museum in Green Bay, WI, back in 2011, though at least the "tender" was coupled behind the locomotive!!
It was switching some cars around, and it fooled me at first, until I got a bit closer and noticed the lack of steam...and the connecting rods on the tender bogies........

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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 8:40 am 

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:53 am
Posts: 79
There ought to be a law! Well maybe not, but it makes me feel better!



If Stone Mountain has a need for steam I feel it will show up in the small saddle tanked version first. Frankly getting rid of their steam engines sounds like the best thing they ever did for steam! Times change, the realization that they didn't need them sitting there, and the move to find good homes for them was probably a very good sign for things overall.

Ben


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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 10:22 am 

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 pm
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
And Tweetsie
And Omaha zoo
And SF Zoo (Cagney)
And Milwaukee zoo
And Billy Jones Wildcat
And Denver Lakeside

Crescent-Zephyr wrote:
The above post couldn’t be further from the truth...

Partial list of Theme parks that currently run steam -

Knotts Berry Farm
Silverwood Park
Dollywood
Silver Dollar city
Disneyland
Disney World
Busch Gardens Tampa*
Busch Gardens Williamsburg*
Cedar Point
Kings Island*

And...
Six Flags St. Louis*
Six Flags Texas both still run steam.

I put an asterisk* by the crown locomotives. All of the others are running historic steam locos. Pretty sure I missed some.

Disney World is currently rebuilding the Walter to have the modifications that was just put on the Lilly Belle. The plan is very much to keep steam running at Disney and in fact steam is still runnig at Disney World, you just have take the railroad tour to see it and the ride is very short. Ha.

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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 10:48 am 

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Location: Somewhere east of Prescott, AZ along the old Santa Fe "Prescott & Eastern"
For the three of you that care, Knoebels Grove Amusement Park near Elysburg, Pa. (between Shamokin and Bloomsburg) still runs (at last report) with a Cagney for its old-time steam train, as well as a much longer run through the woods with a couple different trains, both streamlined diesel and that abomination Blomberg-trucked B-B "steam loco" we've all seen at other places.........


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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:07 am 

Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 11:09 am
Posts: 170
Crescent-Zephyr wrote:
The above post couldn’t be further from the truth...

Partial list of Theme parks that currently run steam -

Knotts Berry Farm
Silverwood Park
Dollywood
Silver Dollar city
Disneyland
Disney World
Busch Gardens Tampa*
Busch Gardens Williamsburg*
Cedar Point
Kings Island*

And...
Six Flags St. Louis*
Six Flags Texas both still run steam.

I put an asterisk* by the crown locomotives. All of the others are running historic steam locos. Pretty sure I missed some.

Disney World is currently rebuilding the Walter to have the modifications that was just put on the Lilly Belle. The plan is very much to keep steam running at Disney and in fact steam is still runnig at Disney World, you just have take the railroad tour to see it and the ride is very short. Ha.

Hey, you forgot to put in Tweetsie Railroad! They still operate authentic coal-fired steam locomotives!

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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:31 am 

Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 12:20 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Maine
Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:
For the three of you that care, Knoebels Grove Amusement Park near Elysburg, Pa. (between Shamokin and Bloomsburg) still runs (at last report) with a Cagney for its old-time steam train, as well as a much longer run through the woods with a couple different trains, both streamlined diesel and that abomination Blomberg-trucked B-B "steam loco" we've all seen at other places.........

The 16” gauge steamer at Knoebel’s Grove is not a Cagney, it is a Crown steam locomotive.

Keith


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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:36 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 11:26 am
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Location: Maine
It should be pointed out that quite a number of steam locos, especially smaller tank locos, were gutted during the fifties and re-rigged with truck motors and chain drives to the axles.
Make's the blood run cold, doesn't it?

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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:37 am 

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm
Posts: 1477
I would never forget tweetsie! Love their railfan weekend, one of the best priced railfan events around!

I never know how to count it though... it’s sort of a theme park, sort of a steam train “attraction” - it’s such a unique place I don’t know how to classify it! Ha.

Same thing with places like the Henry Ford, greenfield village isn’t a theme park to most people’s definition, (even though I do say it’s the Disney for history lovers, and it inspired Disneyland as Walt visited multiple times before building Disneyland) but the train ride resembles a theme park train ride more than anything even though they have one of the oldest steam locomotives (Torch Lake) and in my opinion most beautiful
(the Baldwin 4-4-0 #7) locomotives operating today!


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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 12:04 pm 

Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 12:20 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Maine
Richard Glueck wrote:
It should be pointed out that quite a number of steam locos, especially smaller tank locos, were gutted during the fifties and re-rigged with truck motors and chain drives to the axles.
Make's the blood run cold, doesn't it?

Conversion need not be permanent however. The talented folks at the Boothbay Railway Village took a loco that had been on display for decades after it was retired from service at a kiddie zoo where it ran with a gasoline engine and chain drive. They restored it to full steam operation!
And....returned it to its “as built” appearance.


Last edited by LVRR2095 on Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:45 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 5:00 pm 

Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 10:28 pm
Posts: 292
Crescent-Zephyr wrote:
I would never forget tweetsie! Love their railfan weekend, one of the best priced railfan events around!

I never know how to count it though... it’s sort of a theme park, sort of a steam train “attraction” - it’s such a unique place I don’t know how to classify it! Ha.


Tweetsie and Dollywood (then called the "Rebel Railroad") both started life under the same management as simply steam tourist railroads. Then, they got smart early on and started adding other attractions for people to do and spend money on while they had a captive audience. Dollywood had more land, and Gatlinburg/Pigeon Forge grew exponentially, so it became a much larger venture.


Crescent-Zephyr wrote:
Same thing with places like the Henry Ford, greenfield village isn’t a theme park to most people’s definition, (even though I do say it’s the Disney for history lovers, and it inspired Disneyland as Walt visited multiple times before building Disneyland) but the train ride resembles a theme park train ride more than anything even though they have one of the oldest steam locomotives (Torch Lake) and in my opinion most beautiful
(the Baldwin 4-4-0 #7) locomotives operating today!


I tend to count Greenfield Village and Disney (and few other others) as "people movers". They run steam, but mainly need something to transport visitors from one area of the park to another without walking them to death.
Kevin Gilliam


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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 5:27 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 9:05 pm
Posts: 1053
Location: MA
Clarks Tradeing post run steam last I checked. Also what did these people do to there steam locomotives? I have heard of converting a switcher to a tender dummy but nothing that would "ruin" a locomotive.


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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 6:17 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm
Posts: 1477
Kevin Gilliam wrote:

Tweetsie and Dollywood (then called the "Rebel Railroad") both started life under the same management as simply steam tourist railroads. Then, they got smart early on and started adding other attractions for people to do and spend money on while they had a captive audience. Dollywood had more land, and Gatlinburg/Pigeon Forge grew exponentially, so it became a much larger venture.


Not to mention they got bought by Herschend to create "Silver Dollar City" before it morphed into Dollywood. That's what really brought Dollywood to it's current major theme park state. Herschends had the money to invest and knew how to make it happen (Dollywood is very much a sister park to Silver Dollar City in Branson.)

Tweetsie Railroad is still owned by the family of the founder of Rebel / Tweetsie. I think that's why it has remained the same for so many years. As much as I like Tweetsie... I think they could morph into more of a historical attraction and drop some of the wild west show. But hey, it seems to still draw crowds and pay the bills so maybe I'm wrong!


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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 9:15 am 

Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 11:09 am
Posts: 170
Crescent-Zephyr wrote:
Tweetsie Railroad is still owned by the family of the founder of Rebel / Tweetsie. I think that's why it has remained the same for so many years. As much as I like Tweetsie... I think they could morph into more of a historical attraction and drop some of the wild west show. But hey, it seems to still draw crowds and pay the bills so maybe I'm wrong!

Personally, I really enjoy the Wild West theme, and plenty of other parks still do train robberies, (Silver Dollar City, Knott's Berry Farm, etc...) Either way, I'm just glad no one is protesting that their portrayal of Native Americans is racist, as it's all in good fun.

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 Post subject: Re: Could Steam be returned to Stone Mountain, GA?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:26 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 5:05 pm
Posts: 1227
In answer to the question "How could they do that to a steam locomotive?" Is a locomotive an historic artifact or a means of production? If the former it should be preserved and protected. If the latter you do whatever it takes to make a buck with it.


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