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Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
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Author:  Crescent-Zephyr [ Wed May 18, 2022 3:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
The Durango & Silverton trains are being suspended due to fire risks. All trains. Coal, oil, diesel.

There is currently a 10 acre fire north of durango, and a 600 acre fire near Pagosa Springs.

There is also a 2.5 acre fire near Chama NM so conditions aren't much better near the C&T.

Official announcement -

"Durango Community Announcement
May 13, 2022

Greetings from the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad
We are sending this message to the community to keep everyone apprised of some potential changes to our operating season over the months ahead. We are working cooperatively with the U.S Forest Service and the Bureau of Land Management regarding how we operate our trains while considering weather conditions that could create any risks along our railroad near forest lands. The U.S Forest Service uses the Industrial Fire Precaution Level (IFPL) stages to help prevent wildfires by regulating various activities within the forest. Periodically, when conditions elevate to Level 4 on the IFPL report, all Durango & Silverton train excursions to Silverton and Cascade Canyon will not operate as scheduled.
We are working proactively to daily monitor the IFPL forecast in order to notify our passengers of any service interruptions as well as communicating any other services that may be available as we look to creating alternatives for our passengers. Our first interruption of Silverton service will occur on Sunday May 15 and Monday, May 16.
We want our community to be informed with this knowledge as we welcome and assist our traveling guests in the months ahead. Thank you for your understanding and assistance as we all strive to be good stewards of the public lands in which we operate.
Jeff Johnson
General Manager
D&SNGRR
"
Author:  p51 [ Wed May 18, 2022 5:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
After the insane lawsuit, this was expected for any time fires are issues in the area.
Author:  Chris Webster [ Thu May 19, 2022 9:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
A May 19, 2022 article in the Durango Herald: Durango railroad resumes service, clarifies fire precautions
Author:  rem1028 [ Fri May 20, 2022 12:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
Wasn't this the whole point of converting some engines to oil? Why not just run them now?

John
Author:  NJDixon [ Fri May 20, 2022 8:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
rem1028 wrote:
Wasn't this the whole point of converting some engines to oil? Why not just run them now?

John


There are multiple levels to the fire risk system they are using. At lower levels they can use the oil-fired locomotives or diesel power, but at Risk Level 4, which is the highest level, it calls for a full suspension of service.
Author:  RailMech3 [ Fri May 20, 2022 9:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
rem1028 wrote:
Wasn't this the whole point of converting some engines to oil? Why not just run them now?

John


I can tell you, I’ve seen a handbrake left on cause a fire. Also, diesels and oil burners still have the potential to cause a fire. Alcos carbonize very badly. Then when a chunk of hot carbon breaks free and lands in some dry stuff, boom instant fire.

Diesels and oil burners were for showing everyone that they are doing something to minimize the chance of starting a fire, after that one that was started a few years ago. It probably helped them in the court case a little bit.

From my understanding it is so dang dry down in southern Colorado, that a reflection off a window into some dry brush could start a fire. It’s scary down there. So when it’s this dry, it’s better off shutting down, instead of having the possibility to payout for another lawsuit. 0 income is better than having to pay millions…
Author:  rem1028 [ Fri May 20, 2022 9:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
I see, thank you for the explanation!

John
Author:  Crescent-Zephyr [ Sun May 29, 2022 11:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
Cumbres & Toltec has a fire near them and they have had meetings with forest department. Hopefully the weather changes between now and the start of the seasons but it’s not looking good right now.
Author:  PMC [ Sun May 29, 2022 3:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
Crescent-Zephyr wrote:
Cumbres & Toltec has a fire near them and they have had meetings with forest department. Hopefully the weather changes between now and the start of the seasons but it’s not looking good right now.

Someone in the know posted this on the NG forum:

"Several members of the C&TS Management team had a discussion with Carson NF, Rio Grande NF, NM State Forestry and CO State Forestry on the 24th. The RR presented our Wildland Fire Prevention and Mitigation Plan. We had a great discussion with the various State and Federal Agencies. Cason NF let us know they would not be providing an exemption to the RR for our operations but they would also not prohibit us from operating within our Right of Way. All entities did make it clear that it the RR initiated a fire, all the fire fighting and recovery costs would be billed back to the RR."

If I were them I wouldn't turn another wheel.
Author:  Ed Kapuscinski [ Sun May 29, 2022 7:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
If they're responsible for a fire, why shouldn't they be responsible for the costs incurred in fighting it?

If I spray painted a big penis on the side of your house and you didn't like it, shouldn't I be responsible for paying to remove it?

Just because they're a railroad that we like doesn't mean that tax payers should be on the hook for preventable expenses.
Author:  PMC [ Sun May 29, 2022 10:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
Ed Kapuscinski wrote:
If they're responsible for a fire, why shouldn't they be responsible for the costs incurred in fighting it?

If I spray painted a big penis on the side of your house and you didn't like it, shouldn't I be responsible for paying to remove it?

Just because they're a railroad that we like doesn't mean that tax payers should be on the hook for preventable expenses.

You're an idiot, you like to put words into other people's mouths, I didn't say that at all. I lived in Colorado for twelve years (including a year in what is now a perpetual fire hazard zone) and know all about fire danger, and my parents live in the mountains there and are constantly updating me on how dry it is right now, the need to be able to leave in a hurry with important documents and keepsakes, etc.. But you took my words of caution and turned it into me saying C&TS should not operate to spite the USFS I guess (which is itself idiotic). You need to stop reformulating the words and interpreting the motivations of those whom you know nothing about.
Author:  Mikechoochoo [ Sun May 29, 2022 11:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
John[/quote]



From my understanding it is so dang dry down in southern Colorado, that a reflection off a window into some dry brush could start a fire. [/quote]

I actually saw a sign made with gold plastic reflective letters burn a hole in a car seat parked near it. So yes that is a real danger, a soda can, foil, lots of things can concentrate the suns light.
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Mon May 30, 2022 12:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
In Arizona, statewide:

1) they're using variable message highway signs to tell you not to drive or park over grass or weeds;

2) Any second now I expect the state to ban all smoking outside any building. All outdoor fires and discharge of firearms is prohibited.

3) There are people praying that a hurricane currently churning across Mexico turns up the Gulf of Mexico and up into Arizona--anything to bring us rain.

To be perfectly honest, oil-burning steam at GCRY or diesels at both Verde Canyon and GCRY notwithstanding, I fully expect some authority to shut down operations at both tourist lines simply because of the perceived fire risk, no matter how minimal that risk may be in reality. I sincerely hope I'm wrong.
Author:  Trainlawyer [ Mon May 30, 2022 2:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
A few things to remember before some of you start beating each other over the head with fire brooms -

1. The four operations which have been mentioned here so so far are multi-million dollar businesses whose stakeholders would like them to stay in business;

2. None of them are going to garner very much repeat business by either showing their customers a mountain gloriously ablaze or apologizing for the black air and lack of sunlight;

3. The leading causes of lineside brush fires are brake shoe sparks and assorted very hot solids and liquids in the exhaust. I haven't seen a comparison by motive power, however the problem is NOT limited to steam hauled excursion trains and there isn't even an anecdotal preponderance of such events;

4 If I start a fire in my yard (or cause one through my own stupidity or negligence) and it damages your property I'm responsible. Why do one or two of you think railroads should be different?

5. Fire is natures way of clearing out the natural debris in a forest. When conditions reach a certain point a wildfire can start without our help. Why go out of our way to encourage it?

GME
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Tue May 31, 2022 12:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Durnago & Silverton trains cancelled due to fire risk
Add to the roll call of cancellations:

The Grand Canyon Railway cancelled its monthly "Steam Saturday" steam run for May, has cancelled its steam run for this upcoming Saturday, and has tentatively cancelled steam until enough rain appears. (Nope, doesn't matter that 4960 burns the same fuel as the F40FH's...............)

At this point, it will take a COUPLE of hurricanes/tropical storms' worth of rain to have a meaningful impact in Arizona, after a "total bust" for last summer's annual "monsoon season" and inadequate snow this past winter. And such storms have a very difficult time crossing Mexico or California first.
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