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 Post subject: Was it ever possible to save the Rio Grande Southern?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:43 pm 

Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2021 6:40 pm
Posts: 42
I get that the Silver panic of 1893 was more than partially responsible for the RGS' notorious bad fate. However, were there anyways the Rio Grande's fortunes could have been reversed?


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 Post subject: Re: Was it ever possible to save the Rio Grande Southern?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 3:42 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2004 7:52 am
Posts: 2561
Location: Strasburg, PA
I wouldn't think so. If it weren't for hauling out yellow cake in WWII, RGS might have disappeared during the war in a scrap drive. By 1951 it was so shot and so bankrupt that additional operation just wasn't possible. By rights, to have survived into the preservation era, it would have needed to continue in operation into the mid-60's, and without a sugar daddy equivalent to EBT's recent good fortune there is no way that could have happened.


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 Post subject: Re: Was it ever possible to save the Rio Grande Southern?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 4:40 pm 

Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2021 6:40 pm
Posts: 42
In that case, was there any other resources the RGS could have built to to have resources other than silver? Say its founder decides to also see whether it can reach more coal mines in the area?

Would it have been possible to have a tourist railroad over part of the ex-RGS? Maybe have the RGS use excursion trains more often to stay afloat?

I think the portion between Rico and Troust Lake at least would have made for a good tourist railroad.


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 Post subject: Re: Was it ever possible to save the Rio Grande Southern?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 6:05 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2014 3:15 pm
Posts: 594
If the RGS had survived 10 more years, I’d say yes, it would be more possible to save at least part of it.


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 Post subject: Re: Was it ever possible to save the Rio Grande Southern?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 6:25 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 12:47 pm
Posts: 164
Location: Arizona
As built, the RGS tapped the coal mines west of Durango. These mines contributed car loadings until the mines played out in the 1920's. Until its end, there was a small coal mine a few miles west of Durango. To this day there is a coal mine south of Hesperus, an RGS station 17 miles west of Durango, which supplies coal to the D&SNG, C&TS and Nevada Northern. Most of its output is shipped overseas.

The portion from Rico, over Lizard Head Pass, around Trout Lake, through Ophir and on to Telluride would have made for a sensational excursion railroad. Unfortunately, in the early 1950's, the railroad preservation movement was in its infancy, and no one had the $$$ to step in and save any of it.

The RGS was deeply bankrupt and had been operated under court authority through a reciever since the late 1920's, They were many years in default for taxes owed to the counties it ran through. The local governments were under the impression that through abandonment, they would recover the back taxes owed. It didn't happen.

Getting into the area from the outside was not easy. The roads didn't get improved until the mid-1960's, Rico was on a gravel road. Telluride got pavement in the late 1950's. So, getting there to ride an excursion train took perserverence. One of the reasons, the Silverton Branch became popular in the 1950's is there were good paved highways into Durango.

Lastly, the physical plant was horrid. It was estimated that 3/4 of the ties were rotted. For many years, the RGS had installed untreated pine ties from local mills. An untreated pine tie is good for about 5 years service. The bridges were probably the best thing they had left. The Geese made good excursion vehicles, they were light on their feet and easy on the fragile trackwork.


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 Post subject: Re: Was it ever possible to save the Rio Grande Southern?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 7:39 pm 

Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2018 3:51 pm
Posts: 442
Location: Ipswich, Mass., Phoenix, AZ
I think that I read the RGS sold for $500,000. That's peanuts now but back then it was a chunk of change. Repairs to the rotary would have cost somewhere around $500 as I recall, but money was nowhere to be found. Wouldn't it have been neat to save #22 or #25? I'm sure they went for next to nothing.


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 Post subject: Re: Was it ever possible to save the Rio Grande Southern?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2021 2:40 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2019 11:11 am
Posts: 34
Location: Denver,CO
The RGS equipment was going to be sent to Alaska before the RFC stepped in with a loan to keep trains running.

22 and 25 did go cheap, the RGS cut them up. Both gave up parts to keep 20 running.


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 Post subject: Re: Was it ever possible to save the Rio Grande Southern?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 01, 2021 1:28 am 

Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 11:17 pm
Posts: 321
Location: Houston, TX
As Earl pointed out, the RGS served a part of the country that was still remote well into the 1960's. North of Dolores, and south of Telluride, the highway was was still gravel and often closed in winter north of Rico and south of Ophir, when I first visited the area in 1966. By then Silverton had become well known, and the train was full. By contrast, Dolores was sleepy. Rico was literally dead, with only a single store/gas pump/post office building open in town. Telluride existed because of the Idarado mine and mill and despite being at the end of the paved road, was still rarely visited. My friends and I had been camping out in a tent for over two weeks when we arrived in Telluride, and we splurged on THREE hotel rooms in the New Sheridan for the night. Total cost per room $3.18 with tax, sink in the room to wash and shave, bathroom and tub at the end of the hall. We were the only guests. People were beginning to discover the area, but still, compared to Durango or even Silverton, it was literally off of the map.


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