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 Post subject: GN 1246
PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:54 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:35 am
Posts: 8139
Location: Wilton, NY
When still in the Seattle park, before it was dismantled and taken to Oregon, where it remains, dismantled:http://abpr.railfan.net/abprphoto.cgi?april04/04-28-04/GN1246SeattleWA_June1960.jpg


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 1:22 am 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 12:37 pm
Posts: 439
Location: Missoula MT
Apparently this engine, which is part of the Fred Kepner collection, was solicited to certain individuals within the Great Northern Historical Society (leastwise there was a bunch of message traffic on the gngoat@Yachoogroups list. It may be possible that the Kepner collection may be available for preservation. If this is a possibility, then perhaps tactful inquiries may be fruitful. The original message is as follows: Greetings GNGOATs...The Mrs. and I are back from our two week trip toChina. Yes, I got a picture of myself on the GreatWall of China wearing a glacier green GN T-shirt.I'll be posting my trip notes on my website bythis weekend (I hope).Now for some startling news. Want to buy aGreat Northern steam locomotive? Following isan email I received from a Mr. Martin Hansen:begin email----------------------------------Please pass on that we are selling GN 2-8-0. The price is $30,000.00.Please pass this on to the GN members of your site.Martin E. HansenFrancis Hansen & Martin LLP1148 N.W. Hill St.Bend, OR 97701Phone: 541-389-5010Fax: 541-382-7068meh@...---------------------------------end emailInteresting, huh? I can't say whether the above is legit,but it would be neat if someone would step up and savethis engine from becoming "so much scrap metal".Here is a link to pictures of the locomotive's conditionas of 2002 (scroll down past the GN 1147 Wenatchee engine):http://www.gngoat.org/steam.htmHave a "Rocky" kinda week...LIN-ZMr. Lindsay Korst - Redmond, WA, USAgngoat@... - Member GNRHShttp://www.gngoat.org - Webmaster


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 1:56 am 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 5776
From the picture of the 2-8-0 when it was on display in Seattle, it appears that the boiler was a lighter color than the domes, cab, etc. Was this one of those GN locomotives that had a green boiler when it was in regular service?As for being for sale, it would be nice if a third party could give an idea as to the restoration possibilities of the old girl. The fact that she is currently in pieces and could be moved that way, might be a good thing.Les Beckman (Hoosier Valley Railroad Museum/North Judson, Indiana)


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:14 am 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 9:04 am
Posts: 287
Location: Lawrence, Mass.
Sounds like a good project for the Minnesota Transportation Museum, since they have a GN roundhouse but no GN steamers to go in it.


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 Post subject: 2-8-0 GN 1246 still for sale
PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 10:29 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2004 10:51 pm
Posts: 117
Location: Eastern Pennsylvania
Dredging up this old topic....

My google homepage suggested this article to me:
https://mynorthwest.com/1833535/all-ove ... -1246/amp/

Which says that GN 1246 is still for sale by Fred Kepner. His attorney says that he's asking $45,000 for the locomotive.

I don't recall hearing of Mr. Kepner, but a quick web search shows that he had apparently amassed quite a collection of locomotives.

The 1246 is not a bad looking locomotive:
http://www.gn-npjointarchive.org/GNCasc ... ay1953.jpg

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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 11:14 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 9557
Location: Somewhere east of Prescott, AZ along the old Santa Fe "Prescott & Eastern"
Just do a search for his name here. Get a drink and make yourself comfortable first.

Let's just diplomatically say that you're kind of opening a can of worms, and let it go at that.


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:15 am 

Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2004 1:33 pm
Posts: 400
Location: Oroville, CA
For the time being, let's ignore "opening a can of worms" and talk about value of a displayed, non-active steam locomotive. The 1246 apparently currently has an asking price of $45,000. The one article put a guesstimate on cosmetic restoration at $750,000. It sounded like that was for moving & restoring, but there was no mention of a display building, which could easily add $250,000 (especially if it is a government project requiring "prevailing wage" workers). Now this is in the ballpark of ONE MILLION dollars for what is basically a monument. That just seems like a lot of money (seems like enough for an operational restoration, even) for a display piece. Where would this kind of money originate? And in 25 years, will anyone care for it?
In today's world, finding a place to run a steam locomotive is becoming very hard. Looking back, it appears that the real Renascence of steam locomotives was from about 1980 to 2010. So, what today is the marketplace for a mid-sized steam locomotive, and what sets the value? Note that when Fred bought the 1246 he paid $1,500 (plus all the moving, etc.) because, at the time, it was just a liability needing to be disposed.
Now don't get me wrong here--if I had my way every displayed engine would be restored-or at least in covered, protected shelter. But, I know the real world is much different from what I would like it to be (I'd also like to see steamboats plying the rivers again too. . .. ).
So, what is "that little locomotive in the park" worth now? And, I suppose the other question; can we keep them from the scrappers?

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David Dewey
Hoping for the return to the American Rivers of the last overnight steamboat, Delta Queen!


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:18 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm
Posts: 1089
True story: I thought of Fred Kepner a few weeks back when people were emptying stores of toilet paper.


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:31 am 

Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2004 1:33 pm
Posts: 400
Location: Oroville, CA
One other thing changed since Fred bought the 1246--Asbestos abatement! So its presence would greatly reduce the value of a locomotive due to the added cost of removal (although it would be possible to encapsulate it for a move). One would still have to face the removal expense, although it might be inside a structure by then (theoretically cheaper to do it indoors; concrete floor, etc.)

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David Dewey
Hoping for the return to the American Rivers of the last overnight steamboat, Delta Queen!


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 11:20 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 5:05 pm
Posts: 987
Is $45,000 too much? The Port of Kalama recently payed $100,000 for a locomotive of similar size and budgeted another $163,000 to ship it from Arizona. In order to compare Kepner's collecting locomotives to hoarding toilet paper you have to assume the owner was going to pile the paper and burn it. Mr. Kepner put his own cash on the line when others did not. How many of us have a half finished project that we don't want to part with?


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:26 pm 

Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2004 1:33 pm
Posts: 400
Location: Oroville, CA
I wanted to steer this thread away from being bout Fred's collection to more about "what is the value of an unrestored locomotive (on display or in storage, even in pieces). How do you establish the value, and does it exceed what a scrapper would pay?
As for unfinished projects, the house I live in is an unfinished project. I would be the last person to talk about "hoarding" unfinished projects, just look at my storage buildings (yes, plural) and my backyard. In the words of Walt Kelly, "We have met the enemy and he is us!" Sorry, no toilet paper stashed here, though.
Excuse me, I see another windmill to joust with. . . .

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David Dewey
Hoping for the return to the American Rivers of the last overnight steamboat, Delta Queen!


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 2:00 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 9557
Location: Somewhere east of Prescott, AZ along the old Santa Fe "Prescott & Eastern"
What is it worth? It's worth what someone is willing to PAY.

Now, as an example:
The SP&S 539 was sold to Kalama at a price pretty much in line with what the Grand Canyon Railway could have expected to garner for it in its location and condition. If Strasburg, Verde Canyon, Sierra, Napa Valley, or any other "commercial" excursion outfit decided it "needed" that loco, that's probably what they would have asked--or maybe they gave a non-profit a little price break. It theoretically could be made operable; I assume the asbestos was abated; etc.

Further, for Kalama, the only loco that makes SENSE is an SP&S steamer--and 539 is probably the only such loco aside from 700 which is a whole 'nuther proposition.


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 2:17 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 5:05 pm
Posts: 987
What is a locomotive worth? Scrap+whatever someone will pay. If nobody wants the GN loco for $45,000 then it isn't worth that except to the owner.


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 Post subject: Re: GN 1246
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 11:41 pm 

Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 10:54 am
Posts: 1045
Location: Tucson, Arizona
With scrap steel prices in the tank, you’d have to pay a scrapper to take her. We essentially had to give away a scrap PCC body we needed cut up last year.

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