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 Post subject: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:56 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:38 am
Posts: 925
Developing story from TRAINS:

http://trn.trains.com/news/news-wire/20 ... rter-moves

Beyond charters and private car moves, is this a threat to the future of mainline steam in terms of rolling stock availability and locomotive certification?

Joshua

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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:41 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:07 pm
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Location: Leicester, MA.
I'm really not in a position to speculate on what this means for the wider world of excursions, but it seems to me that the continued development of problems like this are going to make a dedicated home for mainline steam more and more of a necessity...

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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:45 pm 

Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:11 pm
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daylight4449 wrote:
I'm really not in a position to speculate on what this means for the wider world of excursions, but it seems to me that the continued development of problems like this are going to make a dedicated home for mainline steam more and more of a necessity...


Oh, oh, oh! We already have a thread for that! viewtopic.php?f=1&t=41074


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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:53 pm 

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Location: Leicester, MA.
LiveWire wrote:
daylight4449 wrote:
I'm really not in a position to speculate on what this means for the wider world of excursions, but it seems to me that the continued development of problems like this are going to make a dedicated home for mainline steam more and more of a necessity...


Oh, oh, oh! We already have a thread for that! viewtopic.php?f=1&t=41074

We do indeed... So getting serious about the core concept might prove prudent.

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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:08 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm
Posts: 464
I know of a group doing a sweat equity project for the past decade or so on an observation car last used as a camp car, nearing completion, with the dream a trip on the end of an Amtrak train traveling the US. I don't think a trip across, say, eastern Illinois on the TP&W would make up for not getting to see the Rockies or Cascades, etc., even if it were pulled by steam.


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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:32 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 4:03 pm
Posts: 741
Joshua K. Blay wrote:

Beyond charters and private car moves, is this a threat to the future of mainline steam in terms of rolling stock availability and locomotive certification?

Joshua



The answer is hell yes it will. And already is.

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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:09 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:55 pm
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Location: Warren, PA
One of the big beneficiaries of charters and special moves has been media cruises (remember the "Today" show run?) and periodic political "whistle stop" charters, which have certain elements of quid pro quo to them, to say nothing of the annual trip to the Greenbrier.

So lets see how this floats out. But I'd bring this to the attention of your political friends, all of which love a good whistle-stop, regardless of affiliation, and the more rural the state the better. And, as mentioned in TRAINS, some of them have economic impacts that mysteriously happen in districts where mid-terms even happen.

This has ALWAYS been a revenue sensitive, operation sensitive, and politically sensitive area of Amtrak, you don't get it just by asking. So a blanket policy refusal seems particularly harsh unless you're looking to establish your power to do it. Having worked with Amtrak in the past, it was considered a revenue maker, not a loss center.


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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:57 pm 

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A whole bunch of multi-million $$ equipment may have just become next to worthless.


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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:33 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
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Location: southeastern USA
Perhaps we need to consider how it might be done with less disruption and program accordingly?

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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:38 pm 

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Important question; has this been an out of the blue decision, or has Amtrak hinted at this for the past month or so?

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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 7:47 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:19 pm
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Location: Pottstown,Pa.
Unless this is reversed its the end of Amtrak sponsored trips ( steam or diesel) and for all practical purposes the end of PV moves behind Amtrak trains.

A sad day for sure.

Ross Rowland


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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 9:44 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm
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A hopeful reason would be if this has something to do with the antique engines certain operations wanted to force Amtrak to operate. The Winter Park Ski Train ended for that reason, the company wanting to take it over planned to run old F-9s and the like in the mountains west of Denver (altitude 9,000') using Amtrak crews and operating authority, and Amtrak put their foot down. But that was several years ago and if that is the reason I don't know why it came up now.


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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:10 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
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Location: Baltimore, MD
I have been informed tonight by an Amtrak official in a position to know--he normally works within feet of the official in charge of Amtrak's special movements (of all types--think inspection cars, equipment deadheading, etc.)--that:

1) As he is being informed, this edict puts the kibosh on operation of ANY special charter under Amtrak auspices--which does, indeed, mean that a lot of ostensibly non-Amtrak trips will no longer run (think AAPRCO special rare-mileage trains to and from AAPRCO conventions, trips like the Levins' Army-Navy Game special for wounded warriors, etc., or 765 or 611 trips not directly operated by NS or the like);

BUT:

2) There is nothing in this edict specifically against adding PVs to scheduled Amtrak trains, AS LONG AS they run terminal-to-terminal. No adding a car to the Crescent at Atlanta or Charlotte, or to the Southwest Chief at Albuquerque or Kansas City.

This does mean, however, that the basing of PVs at locations other than near major Amtrak terminals has suddenly become economically unfeasible. Think the CP Huntington guys in West Va., or PVs based in such odd places as Winslow and Chandler, AZ. The model used by the Washington DC Chapter and the Pullman Dover Harbor (based in an industrial park off CSX at Savage, Md. and switched to and from Washington DC by CSX locals) will be the only way to go.

I'm certain that the entirety of the "AAPRCO crowd"--especially any that invested heavily in RBBB rolling stock or parts purchases last year--is a mosh pit of exploding heads, despair, and hara-kiri right now........


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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:27 am 

Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:37 pm
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Location: Detroit, Michigan
I'm not too surprise will all the recent troubles Amtrak has been having lately, that they decided it was best cut this service. Perhaps when business is better they might reconsider.

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 Post subject: Re: Amtrak Special Moves and Charters Under Threat
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 1:28 am 

Joined: Sat May 07, 2016 1:12 am
Posts: 70
So does this mean slapping 3751 to the front of a sceduled Amtrak service is no longer allowed or adding historical passenger/support cars to that said train is no longer allowed?


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